DLP aborts at muxing

smaye

New member
Use of VRD and DLP is going great (with all your help!), however, I have one file that no matter what trick I try DLP aborts the muxing process at compiling.

I have tried:
DLP- de-muxing to ES during authoring
VRD- de-muxing to ES when saving
Tytool- de-muxing to ES
DLP- Inserting as mpg and not de-muxing
Tivo- re-extracted and retired everything

Can it be this file is just corrupted?
 

phd

Super Moderator
If it's only one file, it's possible something is corrupt in it.

Do you see an error message?

Was there something different/unusual about this file and the way it was recorded?

Have files recorded after this one authored OK?

What are the properties? Ctrl+L
 

smaye

New member
Hi phd,

Thanks for the reply. Here are the answers to your questions. I hope you can help.

If it's only one file, it's possible something is corrupt in it.

Do you see an error message?


I have NOT tried to re-encode. I don't want to lose PQ unless there is no way out.


Was there something different/unusual about this file and the way it was recorded? No. Just like all the rest I have recorded with HD DTivo.

Have files recorded after this one authored OK? Yes. Many

What are the properties? Ctrl+L
 

Anole

Moderator
1) that's too high a bit rate to make into a DVD.
I'd have VRD lower the bit rate to 10mbps, and if there are no errors, then the source vid was probably not exceeding that rate.
If VRD does report errors in saving, it won't actually -do- anything, but bitch.
(that's not a re-encode, so the save will be quick)
Oh, when your mpeg is demuxed, DLP will report actual bit rate for the vid and audio streams.
What are those numbers?

2) What version of DLP are you using.?
I'm still embracing 1.6, and noting all the bugs they're killing in the version 2 family: 2.0, 2.1, 2.2, etc...

3) I'm personally a little uncomfortable with the 480x480 format.
A lot of people using that seem to be running into trouble.
I don't know if it's the format, their authoring program, the DVD players, or the source (often TiVo).
In the future, can you record at 544x480 or better?

4) as a test, lower the GOP size in VRD, make a save, and see how that works.
Try 48, 36, 24, or even 18 (for NTSC, or 15? for PAL)
(that'll take some time, as it'll have to re-encode for every short GOP)
The 480x480 video already isn't so very wonderful, so I doubt you'll notice a reduction in picture quality.
Besides, you're looking to save this video, so any trick is fair game.

Well, that's my opinion, for what it's worth. :)
 
Last edited:

smaye

New member
1) that's too high a bit rate to make into a DVD.
I'd have VRD lower the bit rate to 10mbps, and if there are no errors, then the source vid was probably not exceeding that rate.
If VRD does report errors in saving, it won't actually -do- anything, but bitch.
Oh, when your mpeg is demuxed, DLP will report actual bit rate for the vid and audio streams.
What are those numbers?
I do not remember for this case, but i did look in to this case, but all the recordings from the HD D*Tivo show this bitrate when you do a ctrl-L while in the editor. After demuxing it is usually between 2.5 and 3.5 mbps. I get no complaints from VRD at all when working with this or other files. It is DLP that says there is something wrong with the file.

2) What version of DLP are you using.?
I'm still living with 1.6, and noting all the bugs that have been killed over the months in 2.0, 2.1, 2.2, etc...

I am using DLP 2.2

3) I'm personally a little uncomfortable with the 480x480 format.
A lot of people using that seem to be running into trouble.
I don't know if it's the format, their authoring program, the DVD players, or the source (often TiVo).
I have had several glitches to deal with along the learning curve, but most all the problems seem to be my lack of knowledge up to this one. Once I got rid of the sticky labels and settled on max GOP length I have been very successful. I think I have done about 25 DVDs now.

4) as a test, lower the GOP size in VRD, make a save, and see how that works.
Try 48, 36, 24, or even 18 (for NTSC, or 15? for PAL)
Your 480x480 video already isn't so very wonderful, and I doubt you'll notice a reduction in picture quality.
I have a rather large rear projection model so it shows all issues with low PQ. The 480x 480 looks the same after VRD and DLP as it did direct from the DTivo. It ain't great, but it is at least as good as I see when watching TV. The DVDs I make look great for my Dad on his 27" TV.

As with you Anole, I have settled on a Max GOP size that works for these recordings from Directv. In my case the magic number is 24 and below. This program was processed with VRD at Max GOP of 24. I guess I could try 18, but the only prblems I got in the past from GOP length were problems with chapters.
 

bato

New member
IIRC VideoReDo will take the file bit rate and try to reencode at that bitrate, because your are cutting all large GOPs, maybe VRD is reencoding those GOPs at that bitrate. Select a 6mbps bitrate (dtivo files are always lower than that), if there is no reencode in your file only the information is changed from 15mbit to 6mbi, of course this is IIRC ;)

Download DLP 1.53, try that or update that to 1.60. The compiler in that version is better for non standard files.

I still don't like the idea to cut large GOPs to make chapters work with DLP, but that is another story.

@anole, the dtivo records the stream, so he can't change the resolution from 480x480 to 544x480, only stand alone units can change the resolution.
 
Last edited:

pwantzel

New member
You might also try DVD Lab (not Pro). And select the Alternative Multiplexer. This always works for me for DTivo recordings.
 

Anole

Moderator
DLP Standard - gone with the wind

In the beginning....

There was DVD Labs (plain), and I think it got up to about ver 1.33 or so.
It did have an alternate multiplexer which was somewhat more forgiving.

Skipping ahead, they came out with DVD Labs Pro (not sure the version) which was based on a new source library.
It lost the relaxed muxer and gave me some fits.
We're talking maybe two years ago, so this isn't news... :)

The also did a "little brother" spin-off of Pro, which they called Studio.
It was based on the same source code, but sold for a price between Pro and Standard, with a few less features.

For a while, all three products may have existed: Standard, Studio, and Pro
So far as I know, there haven't been any sales of DLP Standard in well over a year.
I think support for those customers who didn't upgrade, is slipping.
And actually, the upgrade to Studio was cheap, so I suspect many users did do so.

Anyway, DLP Pro went through a number of revisions.
It wasn't until it got to 1.5 that I felt comfortable working with it again.
Between the changes to my extractor program (puts out better video), the improvements to VideoReDo (puts out better video), and DLP 1.5, I again found a stable development environment.
Up until that time, I had been relying on DVD Labs Standard, ver 1.33

There were several minor updates to the DLP 1.5 versions, and through the 1.6's.
They rarely gave me any trouble.
Most of my video just processed without discussion.
I was happy. :cool:

Then DLP 2.0 came out. I didn't see any new features I needed, so I kept with my reliable 1.6
After monitoring the DVD Labs forum for many months, and seeing the troubles users have resolved in the 2.x family, I am glad to have avoided all that drama.
I just want a simple turn-the-crank (the same way I did yesterday) procedure, that gets the job done. :)

Sorry to have strayed off topic.
My point is, you may have trouble finding old DLP Standard 1.33.
I haven't run it myself, in over a year.
 
Last edited:

Anole

Moderator
IIRC VideoReDo will take the file bit rate and try to reencode at that bitrate, because your are cutting all large GOPs, maybe VRD is reencoding those GOPs at that bitrate. Select a 6mbps bitrate (dtivo files are always lower than that), if there is no reencode in your file only the information is changed from 15mbit to 6mbi, of course this is IIRC ;)
Yes. If it's just a save with no edits, VRD will change only the headers.
IF you have VRD change the GOP sizes, then what bit-rate VRD encodes those shorter GOPs at is dependent on several VRD settings.
The suggestion above is as good as any. :)

Download DLP 1.53, try that or update that to 1.60. The compiler in that version is better for non standard files.
See my previous posting, above. It's certainly good enough.
I use 1.6x, and haven't tried the 2.x family.

I still don't like the idea to cut large GOPs to make chapters work with DLP, but that is another story.
In theory, I don't like it, either.
In practice, I've never seen any affect on my video.
Just got a new big TV, so I may change my tune in the coming months.
HOWEVER, if it's this or not make the DVD, I choose GOP-bashing.

I am not naive enough to think it's really the GOP size that's at the heart of the occasional compatibility problem.
I've proven by experiment in the past, that long GOPs are fine with DLP, and with most DVD players.
What is really happening is that VRD is carving up the video and putting it back together, and wherever the supposed 'bad spot' is, it get re-encoded to normal specs, and DLP no longer has a problem with it.
Sort of like throwing a barrel of walnuts over Niagara Falls, just to get one cracked open so you can eat it.
Kinda over-kill, but if it's -that- or starve, you do what you have to! :D

@anole, the dtivo records the stream, so he can't change the resolution from 480x480 to 544x480, only stand alone units can change the resolution.
I've heard other Dtivo users talk about saving in other resolutions.
Since I don't have a TiVo of any sort, I don't have personal experience with the details.
I've just relied on the sparse comments of other members.
If in fact, Dtivo records based on the stream parameters, and DirecTV transmits 480, then we're done.
Dish sends most of its programming in 544, and my stream extraction remuxes that into the mpg I start out with.

Thank you for your comments. ;)
 
Last edited:

pwantzel

New member
IAnyway, DLP Pro went through a number of revisions.
It wasn't until it got to 1.5 that I felt comfortable working with it again.
Between the changes to my extractor program (puts out better video), the improvements to VideoReDo (puts out better video), and DLP 1.5, I again found a stable development environment.
Up until that time, I had been relying on DVD Labs Standard, ver 1.33

There were several minor updates to the DLP 1.5 versions, and through the 1.6's.
They rarely gave me any trouble.
Most of my video just processed without discussion.
I was happy. :cool:
Direct TV (and Dish) tends to transmit video with large GOPs. For some shows at least, changing to GOP of 18 (the standard I think) increased the file size by 10%! As well as taking extra time in VRD. Have you (or has anyone) been successful processing such material in DVD Lab Pro version 1.5 or 1.6? Without changing GOP settings in VRD? I know the few attempts I made in DVD Lab Pro did not work, but I don't recall at the moment what version(s) I tried. I have been successful in using DVD Lab 1.33, and it does everything I need, so I've stuck with it.
 

Anole

Moderator
yes, I have...but...

After some experiments, where I determined GOPs occasionally exceeded 60, I set VRD to always clip to GOP=48
Don't read this thread; just scroll down to the 4th post. Look in the table.

And, I never proved to my satisfaction that clipping to 48 was necessary.
I just used it as a low-effort, low-risk precaution.
 

smaye

New member
Direct TV (and Dish) tends to transmit video with large GOPs. For some shows at least, changing to GOP of 18 (the standard I think) increased the file size by 10%! As well as taking extra time in VRD. Have you (or has anyone) been successful processing such material in DVD Lab Pro version 1.5 or 1.6? Without changing GOP settings in VRD? I know the few attempts I made in DVD Lab Pro did not work, but I don't recall at the moment what version(s) I tried. I have been successful in using DVD Lab 1.33, and it does everything I need, so I've stuck with it.
I am with Directv. GOPs run about 30 -38 . I have not noticed the increased size files. I had been more worried about re-encoding and affects on PQ. I have been very successful since going to a max gop of 24. I could not see any difference between the original file and the mx 24 file.

I am running DLP 2.2.
 

bato

New member
Direct TV (and Dish) tends to transmit video with large GOPs. For some shows at least, changing to GOP of 18 (the standard I think) increased the file size by 10%! As well as taking extra time in VRD. Have you (or has anyone) been successful processing such material in DVD Lab Pro version 1.5 or 1.6? Without changing GOP settings in VRD? I know the few attempts I made in DVD Lab Pro did not work, but I don't recall at the moment what version(s) I tried. I have been successful in using DVD Lab 1.33, and it does everything I need, so I've stuck with it.
I just did around 10 shows without changing the GOP size with DVDlabPRO 1.6. The 10% is what I got some years ago with mpeg2vcr with the fix GOP option, it all depends on how much better VideoReDo is in cutting and reencoding those GOPs.

For me is not the size increase but the time it takes to break all the large GOPs into smaller and the fact that DVDlabPRO 1.6 can create a project that DVDlabPRO 2.23 can't with the same video & audio files. I hope future 2.x version will work with this files also.
 
Top Bottom